Topic
28 replies Latest Post - ‏2010-05-21T07:38:50Z by SystemAdmin
msiegel
msiegel
7 Posts
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Pinned topic Legacy DOORS forum

‏2008-11-03T19:50:43Z |
Hello Paul and others,
> as the existing forums provide a valuable resource they really must be moved over and not lost. > Anything else would be a retrograde step.
Thanks for your comments in the welcome thread. I moved it to a new thread to keep this legacy forum discussion from clogging up a welcome note.

The current plan on the legacy forum is as follows. What is there will remain there until Q4 2009, but the forums will no longer be accepting new input.

The entire thread structure will NOT be migrated to developerWorks. Instead, several DOORS technical support people will cull through the older forums and pick out the valuable information. These will be packaged up into various forms (Tech Notes, FAQ doc, etc) that make sense. They will then be surfaced in various IBM Telelogic places, such as in developerWorks articles, Tech Support links, etc.

If you have ideas on what is important to carry forward, please share your ideas here. We will be sure that as we pick through he forums, we inform our work via this discussion and share back our thoughts.

In this way, we hope to preserve most of the good information without every last "Tom, Dick and Harry" exchange.

So in some ways (finding every last old historical bit), it is a retrograde. Perhaps one day you'll also view it as an upgrade in culling out lots of junk.

From my perspective, migrating all forum data is hard for lots of reasons including migrating identities of author's into new ID system. Starting fresh like we have was a (lack of) resource decision, but I believe the backwards step is lessened by maintaining full read access to the legacy forum for one year (and selectively beyond that).

I welcome your thoughts.
Yours, Marc
.......................................................
Marc Siegel
IBM Rational developerWorks Community Manager
408.705.0666 (personal cell), email: marcsiegel at us.ibm.com, AIM: marcsiegel10
Updated on 2010-05-21T07:38:50Z at 2010-05-21T07:38:50Z by SystemAdmin
  • kbmurphy
    kbmurphy
    165 Posts
    ACCEPTED ANSWER

    Re: Legacy DOORS forum

    ‏2008-11-03T21:46:58Z  in response to msiegel
    Marc,

    Thank you for your most helpful replies.

    There is a little bit of "noise" in the old forums, but most of the threads stay on topic and there are hidden gems all over the place.

    I can't imagine that tying an old forum post of mine to my IBM ID is of the utmost importance.

    What is important is the fragments of DXL and the talk about DOORS' limitations and undocumented bugs (the nasty baseline bug in 8.3, for instance).

    My only suggestion would be that before you retire the old forums in 2009, that you have what you've migrated live, just so we could do a spot check. You've said it yourself--you don't know a lot about DOORS, so you and your team may miss something that could be vital.

    Even more complicated for you is that Telelogic has done this before. They changed their link structure so many old posts have to have their URLs hacked in order to see them when they are linked from newer posts.
    • pete.kowalski
      pete.kowalski
      16 Posts
      ACCEPTED ANSWER

      Re: Legacy DOORS forum

      ‏2008-11-04T13:16:54Z  in response to kbmurphy
      kbmurphy:

      what is this nasty 8.3 baseline bug? I'm all ears.
      • dpechacek
        dpechacek
        8 Posts
        ACCEPTED ANSWER

        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

        ‏2008-11-04T14:27:29Z  in response to pete.kowalski
        8.3 has a bug they have currently refused to fix where sometimes doing a baseline will throw an error at the end. The baseline was still made and not corrupted. But its annoying to get the error and users don't like it. They say its fixed in 9.0/9.1. My account rep says she'll try to see about getting a fix though but I doubt it.

        I also get the error where DOORS refuses to make a baseline at the next minor revision number saying that the baseline already exists. The workaround is to make the baseline at the next major revision number but when you're trying to keep all your modules at the same revision, this puts a damper on it.

        AAI Services, Textron
        dpechacek@sc-aaicorp.com
        David.Pechacek@gmail.com
        • kbmurphy
          kbmurphy
          165 Posts
          ACCEPTED ANSWER

          Re: Legacy DOORS forum

          ‏2008-11-04T14:41:12Z  in response to dpechacek
          Actually, the bug can be worse in certain situations. In certain cases it's not merely an annoyance (though the only way out of the error is to cntrl-alt-del DOORS). There's a forum post on it somewhere, in the old forums. I tried a search but couldn't find the details. Maybe Telelogic deleted the thread? Or maybe the thread will magically reappear in a few weeks.
          • MvdLaan
            MvdLaan
            2 Posts
            ACCEPTED ANSWER

            Re: Legacy DOORS forum

            ‏2009-03-04T10:58:33Z  in response to kbmurphy
            Hi,

            I just wanted to bump up this 8.3 baseline problem.

            Kevin, did you manage to find this information? How does it get worse than having to Ctrl-Alt-Del out of DOORS?!?

            I found this. But it doesn't help me all that much, unfortunately. Note that we do have the Change Integration installed, but still I get the baseline problem.

            No way to reproduce the problem (I got the error that it was in createBaseline.inc @line 240. Unfortunately not a whole lot of help with encrypted sources...

            Any help appreciated. Thanks.

            Marcel
            • kbmurphy
              kbmurphy
              165 Posts
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              Re: Legacy DOORS forum

              ‏2009-03-23T22:22:09Z  in response to MvdLaan
              MvdLaan,

              I was really going from that post. The worse than ctrl-alt-deleting involved having to send the module to Telelogic.

              Tony,

              It is sad that the attachments have all been removed, which is why I've always pushed for an independent forum and DXL Repository.
    • msiegel
      msiegel
      7 Posts
      ACCEPTED ANSWER

      Re: Legacy DOORS forum

      ‏2008-11-06T09:43:54Z  in response to kbmurphy
      Hello again,
      What shall I call you? KB? Thanks for the historical info on the
      broken links from a prior migration.

      I hear you say the fragments of DXL and the talk about DOORS'
      limitations and undocumented bugs are important to save. But from a
      different thread, I learned that the golden nuggets are attached to
      posts and modules scattered throughout. Wouldn't it be better to
      instead pull out the "large amounts of code attached to posts" and
      "modules which may also contain user built code" and organize them
      usefully?

      I personally really like the dynamic and cooperative nature of a
      user-built and run wiki on dW. An example of such a thing exists
      already in Rational at:

      http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/wikis/display/cm/ClearQuest


      Could a wiki be a useful tool for the community to archive something?
      As a code/DXL repository perhaps?

      Your suggestion "that before you retire the old forums in 2009" we
      provide ya'll with a preview is right on. We all here agree.

      you don't know a lot about DOORS, so you and your team may miss something… vital.
      No worries. My team includes the legacy Telelogic folks like my new
      pal Andy Gurd. In any case, I certainly won't be personally involved
      in culling or editing any DOORS documentation. That will be left to
      DOORS experts.

      Let me reiterate that I am on your side and here to help you best
      transition to the new dW Telelogic forums. I understand and have
      experience with transitioning forums. I myself came to IBM via two
      acquisitions and during each I led my company's online communities
      through two separate transitions/migrations. I even saw the links from
      the first transition get broken and kludged back when we moved from
      Rational Developer Network to developerWorks. So I do know your pain.
      The good/bad news is that in a year from now it will seem like old
      news, because we'll have just finished migrating to a new dW
      forum solution (for 1500+ forums - sigh). Life goes on…
      Yours, Marc

      .......................................................
      Marc Siegel
      IBM Rational developerWorks Community Manager
      408.705.0666 (personal cell), email: marcsiegel at us.ibm.com
      Updated on 2008-11-06T09:43:54Z at 2008-11-06T09:43:54Z by msiegel
      • kbmurphy
        kbmurphy
        165 Posts
        ACCEPTED ANSWER

        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

        ‏2008-11-07T17:24:11Z  in response to msiegel
        Marc,

        My name is Kevin.

        I like your suggestion about the wiki and DXL repository. Thing is I started a DXL repository on my site (shameless plug: http://baselinesinc.com). Thing is, it hasn't exactly taken off as I would have liked it. One reason is my fault--I need to update the interface. The other reason is that the bits of code uploaded there are really good and robust, and thus tiny snippets that are valuable, well, people just haven't uploaded them because they aren't 100% error-free in most cases.

        So even though the Telelogic forum routinely has deleted posts (and they've reappeared) and truncated old DXL, people still post there, even after clamoring for years for someone to start a DXL repository.

        Just look at how long it's taken people to jump to this forum. I know it's only been a week, but some of the more active, well-known posters have yet to jump (the forum is really incomplete without Louie Landale, in my opinion).

        Finally, with DOORS threads, it's really tough to keep the topics as separate as you like. For instance I mention the undocumented baseline bug and how the new forums won't have information like that, so it's natural for someone to say, "What baseline bug?" Many times, a poster will ask something very specific, but what they are trying to actually accomplish has nothing to do with their question.

        Finally, I'll end with a suggestion. If you want these forums to take off after the old ones go read-only, you absolutely must have more Telelogic DOORS people posting. They don't post often at all now (I can think of twice this year off the top of my head) and your openness has been refreshing. I understand it's kind of like asking you guys to poke a hornet's nest with a stick, but I think it's a key element in getting people over here.
      • SystemAdmin
        SystemAdmin
        1084 Posts
        ACCEPTED ANSWER

        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

        ‏2008-11-20T14:43:59Z  in response to msiegel
        <Enable Sarcasm>
        I would absolutely love the deletion of all the posts to the old forum, it would basically guarantee my job security for the next 5 years or so, can we do it faster, 1 year seems a bit long.
        <Disable Sarcasm>

        Ok, seriously though,

        There are no 'DOORS for Dummies' books out there, with a few notable exceptions (Kevin Murphy, Michael Sutherland, Tony Goodman) there are no worthwhile DOORS/DXL sites you can find with a quick web search, and as Kevin's excellent site has shown, it is very difficult to grow a site to critical mass.

        If you want to raise your DOORS investment to its full potential, you need to use DXL. If you want to learn DXL above and beyond what you can absorb from a 3 day Telelogic/IBM DXL course there is only one way, you search the forums.

        In the words of Sir Isaac Newton "If I have seen further, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants"

        Time after time hours of banging my head on the table have been resolved by a quick DXL forum search.
        As Kevin mentioned, we return to the forum time after time despite its shortcomings, because it is the DXL resource. I am convinced that in many cases it is the difference between a company performing a DOORS pilot which dies on the vine, and a company performing a pilot that evolves into an enterprise wide roll out.

        If you really can pick through the posts to preserve the gold while removing the dead wood then all is well. Somehow I doubt it though. As mentioned above, if the problem is about transfer of profiles, no problem, make all the posts annonymous.

        But make no mistake, the forum and its existing content is a major contributor to the success of DOORS, if you want it spelled out in dollar terms, it is saving you a fortune in support desk staffing costs.

        I hope this post doesn't come accross as pure IBM bashing, and I fully appreciate the work being done to continue the forums in any form (thanks Marc and Andy). The wiki is a great idea which I think would add a lot of value to the user base.

        Many thanks
        Andrew.
        • llandale
          llandale
          635 Posts
          ACCEPTED ANSWER

          Re: Legacy DOORS forum

          ‏2008-11-21T15:29:34Z  in response to SystemAdmin
          I echo Adrew's post, except that I'd change 'sarcasm' to 'truthtelling'.

          I echo the consern about attempting to plow through the old DXL forum extracting the 'gems' for individual posting here. That sounds very expensive.

          Perhaps we should maintain the old Telelogic DXL form as read-only indefinately.

          • Louie
          • SystemAdmin
            SystemAdmin
            1084 Posts
            ACCEPTED ANSWER

            Re: Legacy DOORS forum

            ‏2008-12-17T20:49:33Z  in response to llandale
            Could someone post a link to the legacy DOORS forum? I used to browse to it through the Telelogic site and never bookmarked it. Thank you in advance.
          • SystemAdmin
            SystemAdmin
            1084 Posts
            ACCEPTED ANSWER

            Re: Legacy DOORS forum

            ‏2008-12-30T22:01:55Z  in response to llandale
            I'm also adding my voice to the clamor asking to keep the old forums around.

            Besides the points already brought up, I have tons of bookmarks pointing to obscure posts that took me, cumulatively, a LONG time to find. I have them categorized nicely too. I may not use them all that often, but when I need something I know I found in the forums previously, it saves time to use my bookmarks rather than searching again.

            In related news, I had no idea this forum existed until today. It might not hurt to put some links on the old forum pages (not forum posts, unless you made them sticky) so people know.

            Also, regarding these new forums, it might hurt a little, but be beneficial in the end, to add a "Defect/Issue Tracking" forum like at the old ones. I can think of something I'd like to put there; several things, even. But if you do, please PLEASE actually have someone from IBM/Telelogic read the posts AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE PROBLEMS :-D. (Shall I add, "Unlike before"?)

            Chris
  • SystemAdmin
    SystemAdmin
    1084 Posts
    ACCEPTED ANSWER

    Re: Legacy DOORS forum

    ‏2008-11-11T10:39:37Z  in response to msiegel
    Surely, it would be quicker and cheaper to transfer all of the old forum data to this one, rather than go through it all checking for the good stuff? It's all good and useful to keep that history and as mentioned above, there's very little off topic banter. It would be all too easy to dismiss a topic as worthless, when in actual fact someone else will find it solves their problem.

    Simon Haydn BSc (Hons)

    Requirements Controller
    Marshall Aerospace (UK)
    • pete.kowalski
      pete.kowalski
      16 Posts
      ACCEPTED ANSWER

      Re: Legacy DOORS forum

      ‏2009-01-06T17:35:17Z  in response to SystemAdmin
      When I attempted to access the forum today via telelogic.com I was denied access. Am I the only one?
      • jobina
        jobina
        1 Post
        ACCEPTED ANSWER

        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

        ‏2009-01-07T15:38:57Z  in response to pete.kowalski
        Not sure if you are the only one, but I was able to access the legacy forums and it seems people are still posting info there.
        • pete.kowalski
          pete.kowalski
          16 Posts
          ACCEPTED ANSWER

          Re: Legacy DOORS forum

          ‏2009-01-07T21:02:50Z  in response to jobina
          I contacted the help desk and found out my maintenance had apparently expired. I don't think this really happen so working with them to resolve the matter.
          • Tony_Goodman
            Tony_Goodman
            76 Posts
            ACCEPTED ANSWER

            Re: Legacy DOORS forum

            ‏2009-03-09T09:41:09Z  in response to pete.kowalski
            The old forums are still there but are read-only.
            I also notice that all the attachments have disappeared!
            What a waste of what was a good resource.
            Criminal.
  • Strad
    Strad
    2 Posts
    ACCEPTED ANSWER

    Re: Legacy DOORS forum

    ‏2009-03-25T13:54:22Z  in response to msiegel
    The old forums were full of treasures, all those unsupported function definitions were priceless...
    • SystemAdmin
      SystemAdmin
      1084 Posts
      ACCEPTED ANSWER

      Re: Legacy DOORS forum

      ‏2009-05-26T23:39:19Z  in response to Strad
      Hi,

      If any IBM people are monitoring this topic, why have all of the DXL code attachments to posts in the old Telelogic DOORS forums been removed or are at least are inaccessible? There are a number of posts that had some DXL attachements that I would like to get hold of.

      The amount of "Best Practice" content in the legacy Telelogic forums surmount to a collective knowledgebase that is indispensible and goes way beyond just DOORS specific information. Please help us by not removing access to these legacy forums prematurely (until 2011 at least) and allowing full access to attachments.


      Paul Miller
      • pete.kowalski
        pete.kowalski
        16 Posts
        ACCEPTED ANSWER

        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

        ‏2009-05-27T14:02:45Z  in response to SystemAdmin
        I second Paul's motion.
        • SystemAdmin
          SystemAdmin
          1084 Posts
          ACCEPTED ANSWER

          Re: Legacy DOORS forum

          ‏2009-06-01T09:04:48Z  in response to pete.kowalski
          The same goes for me. Has anybody been in contact with IBM DOORS product management about this issue?
          • SystemAdmin
            SystemAdmin
            1084 Posts
            ACCEPTED ANSWER

            Re: Legacy DOORS forum

            ‏2009-06-10T07:48:26Z  in response to SystemAdmin
            {sarcasm}
            Well it seems that our cries have been heard so that there is anymore no problems with the old forum.
            {sarcasm}

            The old forum seems to have gone totally away - when I try to open the support forum the old site just goes to a login screen with this URL

            https://support.telelogic.com/home.cfm?PermissionDenied=doors
            • Peter_Albert
              Peter_Albert
              73 Posts
              ACCEPTED ANSWER

              Re: Legacy DOORS forum

              ‏2009-06-10T08:00:48Z  in response to SystemAdmin
              I can still access the old forum at https://forum.telelogic.com/customer/doors/

              Peter
              • SystemAdmin
                SystemAdmin
                1084 Posts
                ACCEPTED ANSWER

                Re: Legacy DOORS forum

                ‏2009-06-10T08:14:03Z  in response to Peter_Albert
                I got "permission denied" so maybe some maintenance information is out-of-date and does not allow me access.
                • doors36677
                  doors36677
                  47 Posts
                  ACCEPTED ANSWER

                  Re: Legacy DOORS forum

                  ‏2010-05-11T11:22:40Z  in response to SystemAdmin
                  Legacy forum zip files were listed by Steve-Developer... at
                  ftp://ftp.emea.ibm.com/fromibm/rational/DOORS_forum.zip (~50 MB)
                  ftp://ftp.emea.ibm.com/fromibm/rational/ForumAttachments.zip (~100 MB)

                  However, these can not be accessed anymore.

                  Is there a new ftp site for these files.
                  • SystemAdmin
                    SystemAdmin
                    1084 Posts
                    ACCEPTED ANSWER

                    Re: Legacy DOORS forum

                    ‏2010-05-14T09:36:53Z  in response to doors36677
                    I have hosted the legacy forum ZIP files on my site, see http://www.softqa.fi/old_doors/
                    • SystemAdmin
                      SystemAdmin
                      1084 Posts
                      ACCEPTED ANSWER

                      Re: Legacy DOORS forum

                      ‏2010-05-19T23:47:49Z  in response to SystemAdmin
                      Just a cautionary note about the Telelogic legacy archive, I'm in and out it quite often and have found on many occasions that the attachments to some posts are missing from the archive. I tried to follow this up the IBM guy that originally created the archive last year but never got a response. As fate has it, the missing attachments, usually DXL, are the ones that I really wanted. Sigh!!


                      Paul Miller
                      • SystemAdmin
                        SystemAdmin
                        1084 Posts
                        ACCEPTED ANSWER

                        Re: Legacy DOORS forum

                        ‏2010-05-21T07:38:50Z  in response to SystemAdmin
                        Yes, that is true. And it is also quite hard to find the correct attachment even if it exists as the attachment links do not exist in the material.

                        But nevertheless, the files contain quite a lot of information. I use Google Desktop search to find stuff in it.